This American Ride
This American Ride Podcast... Two Everyday Red-Blooded American men talking about everything and anything that pertains to you and our Country
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This American Ride
Military Values Sparking Entrepreneurial Flames
Can military discipline turn you into a successful entrepreneur? Join us as we uncover the remarkable journey of Mark, a retired Marine who transitioned from serving his country to serving up mouth-watering barbecue. Mark's return to New Jersey wasn't part of his initial plan, but family commitments brought him back, where he humorously reflects on his brief political aspirations. Dive into the emotional and psychological adjustments after military service and discover how turning up the heat on weekends with friends ignited Mark's culinary dreams, eventually leading him to create the beloved Sweetwater barbecue business.
In this captivating episode, we explore the nuanced world of barbecue, from the different regional styles to the philosophy of letting the meat take center stage. Mark shares his personal experiences on adjusting to civilian life, the significance of finding new ambitions, and the importance of meaningful relationships post-military service. You'll get a taste of how military discipline and values have profoundly shaped his entrepreneurial journey, transforming a small paintball park venture into a thriving barbecue business. Learn how Mark's experiences in the military prepared him for the challenges of entrepreneurship, emphasizing self-preservation, responsibility, and the courage to take risks.
Finally, we indulge in the delicious offerings of Sweetwater, highlighting the importance of sides in barbecue culture and the logistics behind running a successful barbecue setup. Mark offers invaluable advice for young individuals considering military service, presenting it as a viable alternative to traditional college education. With practical skills, leadership, and financial stability gained from military service, Mark underscores how these attributes can be more advantageous than a standard college degree. Tune in for an episode rich in personal anecdotes, career advice, and the pursuit of the American dream through the lens of barbecue and military service.
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Welcome back to this American ride podcast where we talk about issues that affect you, the average American. What's up everybody? Welcome back to the show. This is George. Last week you heard part one of our interview with Mark, a 22 year retired Marine who served multiple tours in Iraq, re-enlisted after 9-11. And we talked about his service to his country in that first episode. This next episode gets into his entrepreneurship and his drive and his passion to follow his American dream and open up his own business. This is a great one.
Speaker 2:Why in the hell are you back here in jersey? I know why. And this is your opportunity to throw your wife under the bus. Go for it, man, she may kick her right under the bus. She don't even know what this channel is called.
Speaker 3:No, clue somehow somebody will share this podcast with her but you didn't want to come back here.
Speaker 2:no, so, so she's got family and stuff up here.
Speaker 3:When I left New Jersey, I was done with New Jersey.
Speaker 2:That hurts right here.
Speaker 1:I know it does it doesn't hurt me, I get it I just wish I get it too, because I don't want to be here.
Speaker 3:I just wish New Jersey was better. I just couldn't sleep at that.
Speaker 2:I wish it had better weather, I wish I had better politics, I wish I had better everything.
Speaker 1:I understand being here for family, though, because I mean essentially, he's so.
Speaker 2:I did not expect him to be as PC as he's been right now.
Speaker 3:I totally knew it's definitely I'm walking on next show.
Speaker 2:He talked all this trash to me about how he was going to move back to Jersey. He was going to get into politics, he was going to change the course of New Jersey politics. It was a course of action.
Speaker 3:I was like cool man, let's do it. It was a course of action. I didn't say it was the course of action.
Speaker 2:Now he comes back and he's like, oh, like, oh I understand being here for family, though I get it.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I mean, you're here. You're essentially here for family. Yeah Well, the way to put it, I'm not leaving my wife, right?
Speaker 3:I. I personally want to come back home to shovel snow.
Speaker 1:That's wild that's why you're back. So you move back, I'm back, transition out, I'm back, and then uh and you gotta, you gotta yeah like you said, you got, you got a kid in that that time frame he's.
Speaker 2:He's in middle school, about to enter his high school years so now here's a huge fan of you know the game of football he wants to play, that you're doing all that stuff and uh, there was a little. There was a little gap there that you weren't really doing it freeloading off your wife.
Speaker 3:There was a freeloading time? Yes, it was, it was, but what? That goes back to what I said earlier about need some decompression time yeah yeah, so I got out and literally you know some of those men and women that have served for many, many years and some dealings can certainly understand that you need some time.
Speaker 2:It's tough to just jump into some sort of job. Tough to just jump into some sort of job.
Speaker 3:There's studies out there and there's, you know, a lot of writings and things out there that you know people get in or trying to get right back into it. You know, right after military life there's supposed to be a quite a bit of time for pause just to kind of, you know, decompress and cause. I mean you got to understand that like we're a hundred miles an hour, an hour, you know in the military, where we get up or anywhere we're, I mean we're running and gunning from sun up to sun down and to just be done and put the brakes on jump off, jump off the bus.
Speaker 3:I mean it's stopped you're, you know, 100 mile an hour on monday and Monday, and then Tuesday you retire and you're zero miles per hour. So it's like.
Speaker 2:So, but before you, before you moved back up here, there was a passion that was started down South.
Speaker 3:So Probably started before then. But yeah. I mean I, it came a little more to fruition.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because I had to figure out something so, before we dive into what you're into now, how did you get, how did you uh, how did you develop this desire and this passion for for the barbecue game?
Speaker 3:um, well, I mean, it happened earlier on, I think in high school. Um to honest, it wasn't so much barbecue, as it was just a love for food. What started off in high school I think it was Mickey Siler's mom was the teacher back then was the home ec teacher. I thought I was taking an elective to pick up chicks. You took home ec.
Speaker 2:Yes. You're so full of shit, you did it on purpose, I'm not teasing.
Speaker 3:So I picked up home ec because I figured you know it would be a good way to pick up chicks. What are the odds? Dude, we're in high school. I mean, come on, we're going to pick up chicks and home ec where do you pick up chicks?
Speaker 2:and half the class was full of dudes, probably with the same picking up chicks, so you were picking up dudes and it's June, so I'm like this sucks.
Speaker 3:And then, as the year progressed, I kind of got into it. I was just like you know, this is kind of it's a pretty cool shit making you know making kind of pretty cool shit, making you know making stuff from nothing, and I kind of guess that's where the passion of making food came from. And then, um, uh, combined with hanging out on the weekends, um, testing my skills out with you guys, you know doing the weekend parties and stuff like that with the burgers, and you know some of the the, the grilled food, uh, pool parties and shit like that. And you know, I think what kind of took over was that excitement from people saying how good the food was, which I knew they were lying it was hot dogs and hamburgers. You know what I mean. It's just like, oh, so good.
Speaker 2:You used to pour bro. You used to pour some whatever beer.
Speaker 3:You were drinking Budweiser on top of the burger and I'm like, ah, you fucked it up. Yeah, you got pretty much.
Speaker 2:I got excited so.
Speaker 1:I used to pour.
Speaker 3:Budweiser, he's saying my recipe and I'm like, oh my God, so pour Budweiser and accent the accent from meat tenderizer on the burgers with Budweiser and it would. Oh my God, the smell that would come off the grill with those two ingredients on a burger were phenomenal. And throw it on the bone some cheese, and people were like, oh, oh my god, this is the best thing since we were all drunk, by the way, and you were, didn't matter so many, so many piece of coal, so many so many, so many, so many.
Speaker 2:That was my thing.
Speaker 3:so, uh, that's kind of where it went. And then, um, you know, over the years I just kind of saw myself as, like you know, when people come over hosting, you know, just grill it up and doing things, and I assumed I was pretty good at it. Fast forward, get down station in North Carolina at the time, and I found a place where to get barbecue supplies. I went shopping and come to find out that they hold classes. I was like, okay, let me take a couple of these classes. I was totally fucking it up. I mean, I learned so much from these classes.
Speaker 2:You realized the Budweiser over the barbecue frozen burger wasn't really doing it.
Speaker 3:I think that recipe still may hold true, but it was the rest of the shit. I was doing, like the brisket and the ribs and all the other shit that people were telling me were good, and then I found out later on that people were spitting it out and only my true friends were telling me that. Hey, Bert was really saying that the shit was rubbery and he was spitting shit.
Speaker 3:Listen anyway that's kind of where it went. So I get down to north carolina and I'm learning some new shit and fixing because I, I mean, I truly in, you know, enjoyed doing barbecue and wanted to. You know, that reaction I was getting from people enjoying the food and loving the food was a high for me. And that's kind of where it's kind of spun and, uh, I wanted to be better and uh, taking those classes down there at uh grill Billy's barbecue in Raleigh, north Carolina, um, new Jersey, born owner there, uh, joe Pino, um, you know, taught me well a lot of class. I've taken every one of his classes and, um, they welcome me with open arms.
Speaker 3:You know, great community. Um, you know, giving classes every couple, every couple weeks, every couple months, um, you know, on different things, from ribs to briskets to, you know, ret, um sides, you know, you name it, they, they give it out over, um, and he's got a whole store full of rubs and sauces and, uh, barbecue grills. I mean, it's a one-stop shop. And, um, you know, after the first class I thought at home and even though it was a 45 minute drive from you know where I was at on the East coast, north Carolina, I, I was just compelled to just sign up and go. You know it didn't matter, you know, because the community was great, um, the staff, the way they treated you, it was just a relaxed atmosphere and, um, you know, just a great group of people to be around and I learned a lot from them and they got people from. I mean, they get Myra Mixon. You know some of the big names that come in there. Myra Mixon comes in there. He sold, they sell his grills out of there. Aaron Franklin, from you know Texas Barbecue I'm a big fan. Um, you know some of the other pit masters out of there, uh, I think Heath Rowles, uh, mississippi, I think a Mississippi boy comes out, you know he's from Mississippi comes in there every now and again does classes. So they, they, you know they get some big names in and out of their pit master wise, um, kcbm tournaments and stuff. They do state cookoffs. You know wings and different things down there and just it was just a great atmosphere, great community to be a part of.
Speaker 3:And from the time that I was retirement, only because my Marines I was cooking for them. You know, every time somebody would leave or we would get new joins, we would do a little celebration, send the Marines off, welcome our Marines in, and they would always come to my house. I would host them, I would do barbecues and just kind of test things out on the Marines. And when I retired they always told me you need to do this full time when you get out. So I tried it, came home to New Jersey, tried it on my friends, just to make sure, and the rest is history. You know they everybody was kind of like yeah, this is this will pass the sniff test. You know, give it a go see where it goes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I think it's a barbecue barbecue. Barbecue to me is a tough business, having been, I mean, I have a job that has given me the opportunity to travel all over the country, so I've had my Tennessee Memphis barbecue, my North Carolina barbecue, the Texas barbecue, and it's all you know. As you know very, very, very different. Oh yeah, and I feel like, unless you are from one of those areas or you've had a limited experience to have barbecue from real good joint, you don't have the appreciation or don't understand what it is Right. It's like me going on Nebraska making a cheesesteak good joint you don't have the appreciation or don't understand what it is.
Speaker 1:It's like me going on Nebraska making a cheesesteak, like I could make a great cheesesteak in Nebraska. People go like what the hell? What the hell is this cheese sauce on here? You know what I mean. It's like people, they, they don't, they don't necessarily get it. Um, and I think New Jersey you know to bring good barbecue to New Jersey cause there's pockets of it here and there, there's a couple good places, you know, here and there, but it's um, it's an art form and I think people don't necessarily understand that for me, it's because of, geographically, where we're at right.
Speaker 3:So you think, in new jersey, new york, right, I mean we're, we're italian, we got pizzerias on every corner. Stop, yes, we do. You know there's greek food, there's chinese food, there's, you know, a myriad of different cuisines. So how do you introduce barbecue? Or what style of barbecue do you introduce? What will sell here? Right, yeah, what, what's? What's going to sell to the, the taste buds here?
Speaker 3:And that's kind of what my challenge was was um, you know, and you're selling to the public, you can't make it too spicy, salty, too sweet, cause you know there's everybody's different taste buds. So, you, I, what I try to do is I try to just meet right down the middle, right, try to bring a little bit of, you know, the different geographical. Um, you know, styles can, can't between, you know, from kansas city to memphis, to mississippi, to carolina, to texas, you know, bring it all, but not all at the same time, but maybe between all my meats, you know, yeah, you just bring it subtle, well, not, not so hard, uh, you know, so, um, so spicy, with the rubs. Or, you know, introducing sauces. So I try, I don't put any sauces on anything that, I do it just just rubs huge misconception people have about barbecue yeah.
Speaker 3:So just like you know, like aaron, like aaron franklin says, you know if you gotta put sauce on it, it's not barbecue, it should stand on its own.
Speaker 1:I know, and I know the people in Memphis would argue that point because they sauce them ribs up. Why the hell?
Speaker 3:And I totally understand. Listen, I have sauces and I do not have them out on the counter. If you ask for them, I will give you some. And people are compelled to dip. There's people out there just raised on ketchup or mustard or mayonnaise and feel that they need to dip. Doesn't matter what's in, doesn't matter, they just got to dip it.
Speaker 1:Let's be honest, the catch, the French fries and the tots are nothing but a vehicle for the ketchup, right, I mean, that's, that's all they are.
Speaker 3:So I tried it. Like I said, I, I, I try to. You know, for my beef I definitely lean more towards Texas style, you know. Pork, I try to lean towards Carolina style. My chicken is just really kind of in the middle. I just salt, pepper, garlic, you know, rub on there, but everything I do on my proteins is rub. You know I have a handful of sides and everything is made from scratch.
Speaker 1:Um, I, I make, you know I'm, I make it and I smoke, I smoke and every, you know everything is made on the, on the smoker yeah, so, so coming out, I mean I feel like it's so and I and I told this to you multiple times like when you're talking about starting up, I was like now is the time. Like you just retired, like now is the time. Like do it. Like do it now, don't go out and get a job.
Speaker 3:Like do it now, do it now no-transcript shamed it out a little bit, but he was like you know, you were sitting around for a minute before you made it free freeloading is the term he used.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I love you, brother. You're freeloading, your wife is paying your way, but, um, yeah, I just um a lot of. It was not so much. You know, having the, you know the energy or whatever the right term is for it, to go out and do things. The ambition was never, ever an issue for me. I've always been ambitious. I think.
Speaker 3:For me, the pause was the military piece. You know um, getting out and having, you know, being a hundred miles an hour one day and then literally leaving the base with my son and hanging out in North Carolina before we made that transition back to Jersey, was, um, was quiet, it was somber, um, it was somber, um, somewhat disheartening, you know, because, um, I forget where the quote came from, but it's like, you know, if you throw a pebble into a pond, it makes a ripple for a short moment in time and it's kind of like a marine or any service members service. When I retire, we all throw that pebble into the pond and it makes a ripple effect for a short time. But they all adjust to our leaving and when we're gone, once that adjustment has happened, someone's filled our space and we're forgotten and for a short moment there was a lot of keeping in touch, people reaching out, checking in on me, but it very quickly dwindles and it fades yeah, except for those, some of those relationships we spoke about earlier, and it makes you feel a little lost.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, and then not only so. Yeah, you know, and then not only uh. So, um, in addition to uh, the workload that you're used to having and not having none at all, yeah, I mean a lot of weight on your shoulders. And then, next thing, you know, you're wandering around the house and you're like, you know you're, you're fidgety, like what the fuck? You can't sleep, you know, can't stay asleep, and then, when you're awake, you can't find nothing to do. It's purpose, it's purpose.
Speaker 2:You've had purpose for so long, exactly right. And then you transition into not necessarily not having a purpose, but not knowing your purpose.
Speaker 3:And for us, we moved back to Jersey and where we're at it's some of the listeners. I mean, like we're literally where we are, in the middle of the woods. I got three and a half acres and I'm literally in the dense pine barrens of Jersey and if you stand outside, it doesn't matter what time of the day, it's quiet as shit. Yeah, it's just me and my dog, joe the blue healer, walking around Tranquility Ridge.
Speaker 1:Tranquility Change is tough man.
Speaker 2:No matter what you do in life military, non-military, whatever change in general is a difficult thing and doing something for so long and having that purpose and then it's just being over, because I'm sure you knew it was like for the reasons you said, you knew it was a time because you wanted to spend that time with your, with your son, when he's in those years where he's, you know, very in need of having his father and stuff like that. So you like you knew it's the right time overall for your life but at the same time for you personally, like that, that changes. It's a big, big, big change. You know from your own sense of purpose, you know not as a father but as like, maybe as a man or just as a person. So that's, that's like a big, a big adjustment that I don't think people really like understand, like most people.
Speaker 2:I think a lot of people don't ever experience that kind of change in their life because you know they, they get out of high school, they go into something, they do that forever. And you know it's out of high school, they go into something, they do that forever. And you know it's kind of like they just do that forever. That's kind of the path they take. But military is not forever right, you know, but when you're in it you invest everything yeah, I think that's maybe some of the differences.
Speaker 3:so I'm a doctor, I'm. So I'm a doctor, I'm a lawyer, I'm a teacher. Given profession, maybe some look at it as it's a stepping stone for my next move. I got a B plan. I'm going to start off and I'm a teacher. I'm going to start off in elementary school, but I really want to be a college professor. Right, I'm going to start off in elementary school, but I really want to be a college professor. Right, I'm a doctor. I start off as a nurse, but I really want to be a brain surgeon. Like they're stepping stones, I think.
Speaker 3:And the military, it really isn't. You're serving and you serve and you serve. Yeah, you pick up rank, you know, and you're in charge to a limited extent until you get more rank, but you still you're doing what you're doing and at a high capacity. Like we're always on the clock. There is no punching the time clock, there's no. I'm off. Like I get phone calls in the middle of the night because I got a Marine in jail, or he's beating his wife, or you know what I mean. Or I'm dealing with a situation I can't deal with and I need to go, I need to get up and I tell my wife that I have to go take care of my Marine. For whatever reason, you're never off the clock. And then it's not like you call into work and say, hey, I was up dealing with Johnny in the middle of the night with a domestic, I'm going to sleep in. No, fuck, no, get the fuck in here. We got ops. I need you to decipher this shit.
Speaker 1:And be on point.
Speaker 3:And be alert, make decisions because you are Sergeant, so-and-so, gunny, so-and-so. There is no time off, yeah, unless you put in leave and you're granted, and you're off, and even then, I was getting fucking phone calls on leave. Hey, we didn't know you were on leave. Someone didn't show up for work. Can you figure it out? So it's, you know, and there's that, and I see what you're saying.
Speaker 2:But, like for us and I'm not trying to say us versus them, I'm not, I'm just trying to paint a picture- no, I think my point is that, like with most careers, you get into a career field, whatever it is, and you basically ride that bitch out until you're done working. Yeah, right, yeah.
Speaker 1:And then, when you finish, bitch out until you're done working yeah.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah. And then when you finish that, yeah, it's sad I'm finishing my career and whatever I was in, but you're not, there's no more to like. You're basically getting out to right off into the sunset, enjoy retirement and kill over. You're not in your mid forties with the military, exactly Like you do 20 plus years or whatever, and kind of like the military for the most part, unless you're some sort of you know um officer really up there, like the military's done with you kind of a thing. I mean it gets to a point where you're going to be done and you're not done working because you're still young, you're 40, you know whatever it is mid 40s. You can't be done working forever and're still young, you're 40, you know whatever it is mid-40s. You can't be done working forever. And you certainly didn't make a killing doing what you're doing in the military, right, you don't have a lot of bank, so like there's a career after that.
Speaker 2:That comes and that has to be super overwhelming to go from being in the military for 20 plus years, knowing it in and out and knowing your job, and like being on top of it and being like just the tip of the spear, kind of just being awesome. And now you're done and what's next? Like, what am I going to do next? Because I'm obviously not dumb, 45 years old or whatever it might be, and I'm obviously not done. Done, I have to do something else to support my family, right? What is that? Like that's gotta be a super overwhelming I mean, I'm just guessing, I haven't been there you have it's gotta be a super overwhelming feeling of like, what is? And that's why you said the decompression or whatever. Like I can see like just being overwhelmed with that and taking a lot of time to figure out that next step. Like you don't just well, I don't think most people are just rolling into right into the next you know career and not skipping a beat and everything's great. Like I could see that as being tough.
Speaker 3:Yeah, or also you know, no, like you like the point you just said to Georgeorge was at at a young age, you know how could you be wore out, how could you be? You know like need some time. You're still young and I I get that today too, when people ask me hey, what do you do? What are you doing? I'm walking around and like, uh, you know you look so young and how could you be retired? You know, it's just it's. You know words can't describe you know it wears.
Speaker 2:I don't think most jobs, most career fields don't require what being in the military requires.
Speaker 3:Most career fields don't have a pt test but I, you know, you know, but I'm, but I, I'm enjoying retirement, you know, and I'm enjoying my time with my family.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but you're not really retired, though?
Speaker 2:No, you're not. You never really are, you're retired from the military.
Speaker 3:You never really are. And even if you aren't doing anything and those military types out there know what I'm talking about you're always in the yellow zone. You're always on alert, you're always watching, you're always you know, keeping an eye on shit.
Speaker 2:you know, keeping an eye on shit. Well, that's probably something you'll go to your grave with, but exactly Just instilled, I feel like I feel like people retire and they're like they don't understand that.
Speaker 1:Like I feel like when these guys, you know, retire at the and even like even some police I know who've gotten to retirement, who've had, you know, worked in cities or worked in tough areas, like you're talking about a career but you're talking about three back-to-back deployments to iraq. You're talking about deployments to you were in africa, you've been to germany, japan, it's. You've been from one end of the globe to the other. Not all pleasant experiences, you know. So, yeah, I mean beat up. It's like you need some time. I mean you do, you need some time. I'm tired.
Speaker 3:you know I'm tired, but in the same respect there's a piece of me that you know. If I'm called upon it, you know it's just. I'm sure we all feel this way it's I am ready to rock. Yeah, you know I. I love my family, I want to be with my family. But if you, if you serve, you, kind of feel this sense of service, I'm always looking for service. I even the way I treat people like you know, even my barbecue business, the lowest end of the totem pole, I'm sure, but I, you know I'm serving, you know I talk with people. I I want to make sure that I the best of me, you know, and and just if they got something, need something on there for them, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when you have a, when you have a job like that, you don't get. I mean, we were. You don't know that this happened. We were tweeting the other day a guy fell out of a chair. And um, guy fell out of the chair. He was definitely in distress Like he had he had an event. He didn't. He was like, oh, my blood sugar dropped. I was like, nah, you were kind of the court again. You look like you're starting to see as you were on the ground that wasn't your blood sugar he tightened up.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean and it's like right away as a nurse, like everybody sees the guy fall off the chair, but I'm looking to see. You know the other stuff other indicators where his wrist?
Speaker 1:how are his arms positioned? Is he relaxed? Is he not relaxed? Not relaxed? You know, you just you're just looking at, you know your training is what your training is and it will always be Right, you know. So you just you're going to look at things when you have a job requires that level of training. You're just going to look at it a little bit differently, right, but how do you feel like? So, 20, 23 years, 22, 22 years, how did that prepare you to start Fats Barbecue? Like? How did that? Like, what did the Marine Corps teach you in life that gave that? Gave you, you know, the confidence to get out and start a business from from nothing.
Speaker 3:You know, I think for me, like I said initially, it was a little the motivation getting off the ground and just taking that leap forward. Like I said, initially, it was a little the motivation getting off the ground and just taking that leap forward, all those risks involved, you know, and I didn't want to take out any loans, I wanted to make sure that I was able to do it on my own. You know, yeah, and that is just that. You know just self-preservation, just you know responsibility and the Marine Corps Some of that comes from. You know, the Marine Corps is just being responsible for your actions, right, um, understanding the risks, um being responsible, and um, you know drive and uh, you know just kind of focus. You know some of that is kind of what came to the surface. Um, once I was able to get my plan together, um, some of that stuff that I learned in the military, you know, having a plan and you know and and um, you know, categorizing things and weighing risks and options and, uh, rewards and things like that, um, you know, was really kind of helped me get it pinpointed down to where I could manage it. And once I figured out, you know, hey, you know this is manageable and I have the budget and I can do all this stuff. Um, at that point it was just really about, um, you know, this is manageable and I have the budget and I can do all this stuff. At that point it was just really about, you know, dedicating myself to it. You know, like, hey, if I'm going to take that step, you know stay. You know, stay on point, stay mission oriented. Those are some of the Marine Corps ways, you know. Just, you know you stay on mission and you complete the mission and um, you know it's kind of where.
Speaker 3:Where I went and started off very small, uh, you know, at a, at a micro level, um, I got an opportunity at a at a paintball park where I was able to kind of just hone my skills and and, um, you know, learn the operations and figure out my flows. And and then, uh, from there I got another opportunity and you know it was kind of a more of a grand. You know scale or more more customers or foot traffic or foot traffic. And um, you know it's kind of where we're at now and you know I just, you know it's just about with barbecue. It's not like you throw something in an oven. Throw something on a fryer. You know anybody knows barbecue it's. You know it's about commitment. It's about time management, right, you know it's a lot of hours watching meat, watching meat.
Speaker 1:You're such a pervert. We're way too many bourbons in for you to say meat to Bert and have him not laugh at it, not meat.
Speaker 2:Watching, meat Watching meat Watching meat Watching meat cooking. I feel like eighth grade gym class. You're watching my meat.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I mean it's. But the thing is it's not so much for me about, I mean, what the Marine Corps instilled in me obviously is instilled in my business plan. But for me it was more about, you know, making me what makes me happy. Yeah, you know it's like for golfers getting out there on the golf course early in the morning when nobody's around smacking a ball. You know, just nobody's, nobody's out there no sights, no sounds, just you and nature.
Speaker 3:Whatever you a fisherman, you know out there standing in a river, fly fishing or on a boat, you know like it's calming. I'm sitting out there and I'm watching a fire build. I get to my temperatures and I throw the meat on the grill and that's all I'm doing. I'm sitting out there, I'm drinking my coffee. It's early, I mean dark, zero, dark 30 in the morning, and it's just me and my grill Brings you peace.
Speaker 1:It is, I mean, dark zero, dark, 30 in the morning.
Speaker 3:And it's just me and my grill Brings you peace. It is. I think it's kind of what has helped me with some of whatever is going on with me, you know with my past, and you know things going on. You know what.
Speaker 1:I mean yeah.
Speaker 3:So it brings me peace and I found something that I enjoy doing. And that's what they say If you love what you do, you'll never work a day in your life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but the reality is where you're still really early in your entrepreneurial career, right, you're still learning things. This opportunity at Sweetwater is an amazing opportunity for you, but you're still you're still very young in in this journey, right? Um, yeah and uh, like you're, you've, you've been presented with a great opportunity. So, like what are your? What are your overall goal? Like you, still we're not at the finished product of fats, barbecue, or or the journey or the story that you're going to tell. Um, like what? What is it that you envision you know this going to as far as barbecue. Like what? What are your goals? What are your dreams as far as barbecue is concerned?
Speaker 3:um well, I mean, to be honest, I've really never thought of it beyond, just, you know, something to keep me busy, keep my mind off things, right, little extra money in my pocket. I really, you know it's not like that, I needed it, it was just. That was kind of what helped me with my step out to do it was if I fail, no big deal, right. If it doesn't work out, no big deal. It's just something I like to do, and if it works out, great. If it doesn't, no, no harm, no foul. So I really haven't given a lot of thought. I do have some ideas. I've been really given a lot of thought to where, where we're going, where fast barbecue is going.
Speaker 3:You know, I only know where, where I came from and where I'm at now. You know, right now I'm enjoying. You know I only know where I came from and where I'm at now. You know, right now I'm enjoying, you know, enjoying the ride, like I said. You know, coming from a paintball field. You know where I could expect 20, you know, 20 customers in one day and then another day could be 75 customers. It just it wasn't consistent enough for me to, you know, to build off of, and I, but I wanted something to build off of, so I wanted that foot traffic and Sweetwater has kind of provided that for me.
Speaker 3:You know where they are today, every weekend thing. You know where I know that I can sell a hundred plates. Now it's like, okay, now I'm here. You know the places. There's no better place. You're on the water, right, the vibe is great. There's a band every Friday, every Saturday, friday, saturday, sunday. You know the diversity of people in the crowd is from young to middle-aged to old. I mean you can't beat it. I mean the best customers around. They come from all over, you know, from New York, north Jersey, pennsylvania, south Jersey. I mean all over the place, you know, and they are, they're a great customer base. I think it's going to take a minute. I've only been there for about four weeks.
Speaker 1:So for people to know you were at the we call it the Sweetwater Casino. It used to be the Sweetwater Marina River Deck the Sweetwater Marina River Deck that's right On the Mullica River, mullica River.
Speaker 2:It's an amazing spot. It is. It's an amazing vibe.
Speaker 1:It's truly a gem. It is a gem of the Pine Barrens. I mean it really is.
Speaker 3:I mean, it's a different weather pattern.
Speaker 1:It really is okay, I mean well you spent some time down there.
Speaker 3:So I mean I'm, when I'm, when I'm saying like when rain and heat and I mean other elements come into effect, it literally comes right up, you know, from the direction opposite side of the river from us, and then it literally dissipates and it's like I mean the weather is so great, I mean there's always a breeze off the river, you know, and especially in this hot weather right now, I mean it's been like in the high nineties and I'm sitting out there and I'm grilling and it's hot already by the grill.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is hot by that smoker.
Speaker 3:But I mean, like literally, we're right on the bend of the Mullica coming around and it sits right there and the breeze coming off the Mullica just cools you right off and the wind is blowing and people are sitting out there and it's just like it's hot as shit, I'm telling you, but a couple of cold drinks and the breeze coming off the river, I mean it's just the weather pattern stops on the opposite side, on the Batstow side of the river. It really does, and I was even looking at it the other day. We were supposed to be getting some record heat and it literally, when I looked on my weather app, the colored map showed it only coming to the edge of the river bank and going like out East. It never came across the river where we were at.
Speaker 3:Oh, wow. So I mean it's a beautiful place, it really is. They have a really sweet piece of property out there and they're doing well out there. Uh, mike the owner and his wife, kim, uh, very welcoming, um, you know they've, they've brought me in. Um, I mean literally very, very, um, small amount of you know, conversation about.
Speaker 3:I mean, as soon as I brought up having barbecue out there, they were all on board, you know. So really not a lot of conversation about it, I mean. And once I brought it up, you know small bout of conversation and they were like, yeah, let's do it. Got me a shed out there, uh, right there by the shed, and uh, the tiki bar outside. I got it fits all of my equipment in there, all my smokers right out on the backside of it, and I'm out there, you know, every Saturday and Sunday and, um, you know, like I said, four weeks and things have been good, been positive. The customers I got repeat customers already. They're already, you know, a lot of positive reviews, people talking about it. Um, the neighbors not a lot of places to go for food out there. There is not nowhere. There is not one spot on the road out there.
Speaker 2:It's uh, got pizza yeah, I saw other than that pizza, you might have to go to hammond well, you little lake, uh, egg harbor, city, egg harbor, or or hammond, yeah, they're all.
Speaker 3:That's super close, I think they're all like 25 minutes away to get anything yeah, so in that area I mean, I'm not quite sure what the you know how many households on that road, but there's quite a, there's quite a few houses on that, on that stretch of road out there between you know Sweetwater and Chatsworth and you know Green Bank and all those places, there's no place to eat out there, waterford.
Speaker 1:I mean I gotta tell you there's, I love your brisket. I mean I got to tell you there's I love your brisket. And I mean to me I've had some of the best pulled pork in the country and pulled like personally, pulled pork is pulled pork is pulled pork Like. If you're messing up pulled pork, you should just shut your barbecue joint down, right Like people should be able to. You should be able to do that.
Speaker 3:You could put pulled pork in a crock pot and be okay.
Speaker 1:Right, like you could do that, but you could do that. Don't be hating on Baby Ray's. I love Baby Ray's. Brisket is not that way and I love you Brisket. I appreciate it, but not the favorite thing that you make of mine. I'm about the wings. Oh stop, I do. I love the wings. I like the wings in the Alabama sauce. It's the small things. The brisket's the best.
Speaker 2:Thing you make. I like the wings in the albana sauce. It's the small things, it's just like you know.
Speaker 3:The brisket's the best thing you make, bro, I love my brisket.
Speaker 1:I like the brisket. I like the brisket. That's good and that's Texas style.
Speaker 3:That's my. You know my ode to Aaron Franklin out there who does the.
Speaker 1:SPG, and I'm sure he does. I think his hidden gem is the ratio of salt and pepper. I think that's because I don't think there's anything else that goes on.
Speaker 3:There's not really much you need to do with beef. I mean beef is it loves, salt it loves pepper it does. But I don't think Aaron's secret is in what goes on in the brisket. I'll have to let you. I might not even be able to let you know, but I'm going to my. My plan is to get down there and do one of his personal classes one of his personal classes down in his, his little.
Speaker 1:I'll see and. I think, I think his secret is the smokers he builds. Yeah, it could be, cause he builds all of his own too, is real fire and smoke.
Speaker 3:Yes, which is part of your part of your philosophy is live fire and smoke. That's right. A lot of people, you know they smoke on different things between gas and you know, um, convection and different. You know elements of heat, and I think that my personal opinion is is that the best things, from pizza to barbecue to anything that you cook over a live fire and you know wood, um, you can taste the difference. You really can there?
Speaker 3:there is a difference, just like there's a difference between different. You know you go into a different geographical region and the bread tastes the difference. You can taste the difference between pizzas in different areas when you go around the world.
Speaker 1:Bread tastes different it definitely does it's the most bizarre thing and it's the small things.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that makes a difference you know, yeah, the water in your recipes, the, the flour, the, you know, the dough, the, I mean recipes, are it, you know? And fire, and to me, you know fire and the wood and you know live fire and smoke is makes a difference. It really does. Yeah, I could taste the difference. I got a, you know friends, like I said, pizza, you know you go to a place that makes the, the pizzas, in a, you know, in a regular oven, and then you got those that make it over, um, you know where they put wood and charcoal in their, in their brick coal fired maybe it's definitely different.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it tastes a little, it tastes different, but um yeah but, yeah, I'm happy to be there at sweetwater. I mean, like I said, the vibe is great. Um, you know they're accommodating and um, you know the diversity of people. This is one of the favorite things that I like to see out. There is, um, the diversity of the different people out there. The boaters I got to figure out a way to get in touch with the boaters. I got to get neat to the boaters, yeah, I feel like you poo-pooed.
Speaker 2:I feel like you poo-pooed the whole thing of goals and barbecuing as just something to take your mind off of things. But I don't really believe that. I feel like you have a passion for it. I feel like you're a passion for it. I feel like you're always thinking about it and just from talking to you, I know you're thinking about other ways to get your barbecue to other people, like we've talked about. You know, being on the mullica river at sweetwater it's a great opportunity, but you're already thinking about how to get it out to people out on the water on their boats and stuff like that. So I think you downplayed that a little bit. I think you're really into it. I think you're really passionate about it.
Speaker 2:Um, I think your brain's always kind of figuring, figuring out how, what. The next step is, what is it? Um, and again, like, obviously you're early in this journey. You know we we didn't bring on somebody that's, you know, world renowned for their barbecue. We brought on somebody that's, you know, world renowned for their barbecue. We brought on somebody who's really just like getting into this thing and then like, not that we had access to somebody that's world renowned in barbecue.
Speaker 2:But you know you're like you're you're, you're, you're into it and you like it, and it's really obvious how passionate you are about it. And I think your brisket's amazing. I think it's awesome, I love it. It's definitely worth a little ride out to Sweetwater or wherever you're making it. But no, my point being that I just think you kind of downplayed that a little bit. I think your passion for this is a lot bigger than just trying to take your mind off of other things. I think you're, I think you're into it and I think it's really cool, and I like to see, I like to watch you and listen to you talk about it, because you're just like your brain's turning and you're and you're thinking about ways of like just growing this thing, like like a big proportion, which is what I think people that are successful in things do. You know, I think they're always thinking about how they can be better, and I think that's pretty cool. That's part of the passion right, yeah.
Speaker 3:I mean he, he, you know he's, he's spot on. I'm always you know, but I don't divulge a lot, I'm a little closed hole, but I mean you know he's right. There's always, you know. I mean I mean any successful business, you're always looking to what is the next step right. So for me is that being mobile, am I happy where where I'm at, and just kind of expand from there virtually, you know, is it? You know just kind of stay where I'm at and just try to figure out a way to get on the water. I mean all those ideas, I mean they're plausible, right and they're, you know, ideas that I wrestle with all the time. You know when in business, you know you have to make right. You know risk versus reward. You got to make good decisions right, so will it make sense for me to get you know risk versus reward. You got to make good decisions right, so will it make sense for me to get you know um, food on the water?
Speaker 1:probably you know, but would it make sense for you to be selling your barbecue rubs and russo's market down the corner as a start right?
Speaker 3:most definitely right partnerships and, you know, I think I and that might going back to what is the Marine Corps taught me right. So, being a little reserved, right Waiting, being patient, right Executing when I need to execute, um, you know, and just kind of being patient and letting things happen, and I'm I'm kind of somebody of that thinking, right, I just things happen for a reason. Um, be in the right place at the right time, you know, and just do right by people, right, and hope that good things happen. And that's kind of where I'm at. I'm just I'm in no rush and so the cards are in my hand. I can do what I want, yeah, um, you know, for me, I think that's, I think that's what makes me kind of unique, I don't need to do this. But I, in your to your point, bert, is I like to do it? Yeah, and I'm in a position where I can, you know, I can make my own, I can make those decisions and and and kind of be patient and sit back and not have to rush into decisions, right, but all of those are all you know, they're ideas. I mean, I want to diversify, Right, I'm constantly thinking about my son and where he's going to go.
Speaker 3:He's got three more years before he goes to college, you know, and hopefully play D1 football. My wife, who you know she's working at the VA, she wants to retire at some point. My wife, who you know she's working at the VA, she wants to retire at some point, you know. So I weigh all those options and how deep and in-depth I want to get and do what I need to do. Or we stay in New Jersey, right, it's tough to retire here. I'd like to. I mean, I like what Sweetwater has. I'd like to have a spot on the water where people could just I could entertain, you know, multiple customers whether there be waterborne or whether they, you know, be foot traffic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I see you, um, owning a place like that, not working at one or doing what you're. I think right now, sweetwater is the perfect thing for you and where you're at in this journey. But I just I personally see like much bigger things, um, and like owning a spot like that and you know, whether it's in jersey or it's down south in the carolina, wherever I don't know, I don't know what it holds for you, but I just see you being bigger than that, not working for a place like Sweetwater, but owning a place like Sweetwater. That's just what I see, just knowing you and knowing your passion for it and your work ethic and your drive. But I think, right now, sweetwater is perfect for you, like, I think it's a great stepping stone for you.
Speaker 2:You know, coming from where you're coming as early as you are in this barbecue journey, like, let's be honest, you're not that far into it. You know what I mean, like and Deppie, putting out the food that you're putting out right now, the quality of the food that you're putting out, as early into your barbecue journey as you are. Yeah, I mean, I, I'm impressed, man, like, obviously we're friends, we go way back, I'm one of your biggest fans. But um, I'm also gonna tell you, but like I busted your balls when you burnt the chicken wings at the halloween, thing like I'm like your wings suck bro, like uh, you know, like that's that's where we come from, that's that's the relationship we have.
Speaker 2:I'm not gonna sugarcoat it for you. I really legitimately like your brisket and your mac and cheese and your cornbread is banging like the potatoes, like all, like all this. Legitimately, I'm a fat guy. I'm not gonna tell you if I like food or not. Like it's, it's good, man, and I think it's like it's. It's the kind of good that, like, will reach the masses if, like you can get it to the masses.
Speaker 1:Like people like it you have to get it to the people yeah, and you're still going on word of mouth.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. Like we're still we're still in the early phases of this.
Speaker 3:And that's kind of, you know, with the foot traffic that Sweetwater has. That's in the four weeks, five weeks I've been there. That's been the consensus. I have no negative reviews. I mean I have the neighbors you know in and around Sweetwater that just come there to eat barbecue and then they, they, they leave, they don't even hang out. You know, I got repeat customers that come in and around Sweetwater. I'd just come there to eat barbecue and then they leave, they don't even hang out. I got repeat customers that come in there and they just hang out at Sweetwater.
Speaker 1:What do we have here? Hold on, what do we have here? What's going on? We have a Mark's like. What's going on? We have barbecue.
Speaker 3:Barbecue Okay.
Speaker 2:Oh, I get to eat this. Well, some fish, yeah, I brought some samples.
Speaker 3:Holy, I brought some samples, for this is like pre-arranged, like out of this.
Speaker 1:Well, I don't let everybody in on all the plans this is some bullshit. Thank you, thank you, thank you beat it, women brisket.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, yeah man.
Speaker 1:Did you bring a fork?
Speaker 2:in Somebody? Where's my camera at?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't know if I can show this oh yes, Bert has all the forks, so somebody yeah you guys don't get those.
Speaker 3:I brought some Fats Barbecue and, I think, one of my unemployed employees that I do not have brought some of my barbecue and so what you're so, what I'm holding here, if you could see here, so I, this is a plate um of my smoked chicken wings, a green beans with bacon and, uh, coleslaw and everything, like I said earlier, is all made from scratch and and and smoked and cooked on the bar on the S on my smoker.
Speaker 2:I really wasn't looking to eat another meal today, but holy snuggies, what do you?
Speaker 3:got over there burt. You got my brisket or my pulled pork, so I've got your brisket which, honestly, I haven't even touched yet.
Speaker 2:But you got your mac and cheese and your. So what are you calling your potatoes? Because these are your potatoes.
Speaker 3:So those are my seasoned diced potatoes and basically it's a garlic butter, pg, salt pepper, garlic. So good, diced potatoes. Mac and cheese is killer dude. And mac and cheese is my blend of some different herbs and spices. Use the cavatappi noodles, which is the spiral with the ribs in it. Instead of just using the elbows. I wanted a little bit more meat on the bone. No, it's a good choice. A little more forkful. I wrestled around.
Speaker 3:I think I originally started my mac and cheese with penne pasta and I thought that it was a little bit too much bite, so I switched to the cavatappi. George has the pulled pork over there.
Speaker 2:Oh, you got the cornbread, you got cornbread.
Speaker 1:So this is what and Bert hit on this before is people who don't know barbecue haven't been to real barbecue joints. They it's not just about the barbecue, the sides are a big part of barbecue. Like when you go to get barbecue, the sides are a big part of barbecue, and I would venture to say that I feel like there are. There's definitely a place in alabama that we go to that's just um, it's south of Birmingham. Their sides, their sides, are as good, if not better, than a barbecue.
Speaker 3:Right, right, you know cause.
Speaker 1:Alabama. I feel like Alabama's Alabama is a funny spot for barbecue, right, it's um they do. And then this, this place that we go to, is it's in a residential neighborhood. That's how you know he found a good place. When it's in a residential neighborhood, and it's um they do, you know, they do ribs, they do brisket, all that's okay, right, but what they do is they do chicken, they do half chickens, they do wings, they do drumstick platters, right, right. And with the Alabama, people don't know Alabama sauce. What is Alabama sauce for people who?
Speaker 3:don't know. So when I make my Alabama sauce, I think I try to stay true to the original recipe. It's mayonnaise vinegar with some spices in it, but basically that's the base of the recipe is mayonnaise and vinegar, yeah, and it's got some salt and pepper in there and all the different juices between apple juice, lemon juice, and I primarily use that for my wings, but you can use that on anything. People use it for salad dressing. You can use it. It's so versatile, you can use it on a myriad of different things.
Speaker 2:It's a really good sauce.
Speaker 3:It really is a good sauce.
Speaker 2:Let's be super transparent here, right, this food here. You made this last weekend for last weekend's yeah, so I so this was the food that was left over this is left over yeah, from your saturday sunday not sell. It was a bad, it was so let's say well, I'm not trying to get it, I know, I know, I know that's not your fault, that's that's that set the stage.
Speaker 3:I mean it was like 107, we had, we had and I had no customers excessive and no customers point.
Speaker 2:My point being with this is um this, he, this was made for saturday and sunday. We is, today is wednesday, and I just had a piece of the brisket man.
Speaker 1:It's like it's microwaved.
Speaker 2:I'm not quite sure how you did it. Microwaved, microwaved, well, I mean microwave is kind of insulting. I think the brisket tasted amazing. I just had a little bite and I'm like holy crap.
Speaker 1:I think this cornbread tastes as good as it did on. It's amazing.
Speaker 2:As you guys came. How is it still good like and that's the point.
Speaker 3:Is you hope that it holds those flavors right? So I mean I so good, I yeah, it did not get sold. So I came home on monday and I vacuum sealed it and its juices and refrigerated it and kept it held over and I knew we were doing the podcast so I, bro, you could, you could ship this across the country like that, and I know, I know that you do that, I know that you knew that I know that you knew that and I knew that we talked about this stuff, but I'm just kind of amazed at how, I mean, I had to buy the brisket and I'm like wow, well, that well
Speaker 3:it doesn't taste like bringing it live three, four days old because I wanted to make sure you guys could taste it. I wanted, I wanted to see I can't be your friend did it.
Speaker 2:I can't be your friend. I mean because this is I mean literally.
Speaker 3:This is the first iteration of me holding food over a couple days and and presenting it to somebody and having them reheated in a microwave and seeing what it tasted like well, so it's good. There's that, I mean it's killer.
Speaker 1:It's as good as it was. This cornbread is killer.
Speaker 2:Stop, dude, with the cornbread.
Speaker 1:Four pieces of that cornbread.
Speaker 2:I mean no if you're four Drunk son of a bitch.
Speaker 3:All right, so I got to pass the meat on the bone.
Speaker 2:His cornbread is so good.
Speaker 3:Let's see if the meat on the bone.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's. Let me slide this meat on the bone around. That's impressive. Grab you a wing, give me a wing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we're doing some food tasting here on the this American Rye podcast today. I make it so.
Speaker 2:I know what it is all about.
Speaker 3:I don't need to taste it Microwaved smoked wing in Bert's mouth.
Speaker 2:Flavor's amazing.
Speaker 1:Let's go.
Speaker 3:It probably still isn't. Is it falling off the bone?
Speaker 1:I don't know yeah, for the most part yeah.
Speaker 3:That's what you lose, kind of, once it cools down. It's really good.
Speaker 2:Sorry guys, we're chomping in your ears, but I'm glad they just brought food into here and I've been drinking oh, okay, so it's good because you're drunk.
Speaker 3:No, no, no, no, I'm glad, thank you, tell me I mean fast barbecue is all about constructive criticism. I'm not going to be a really good man I'm never going to be a better pit master if you all don't tell me what the hell's wrong I'll tell you if your stuff sucks.
Speaker 2:I'm impressed that it's this good after right. So imagine, and I had it, I had it saturday, so I know how good it is fresh fresh off to go I know how good it is, but I'm just trying to give you an idea that I mean, we were just really we were eating wings off of the smoker, literally yeah, they were still burning.
Speaker 2:Yeah, pretty, pretty awesome. I'm a big fan. I may be biased, but, um, I'm a big fan. I think, uh, if you, I know we have people that are, that are local, at least within reason get out to sweet water while you can. Man Um, that's barbecue is going to be out there for a while. Right, you're going to be out there until he's all.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I think, uh, you know atmospherics are good. I think the owner and the manager out there are like, um, that you know they want me, they want me around, right. So they're doing, they want to do and, um, you know talks, or they they want to do and you know talks, or they want to keep me around, right. So I was there initially to help offset the kitchen.
Speaker 2:They get swamped, extremely busy. They get way more people on that property there to hang out, listen to music and party than their kitchen can handle for sure.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I mean, aside from me, tong is his name, the sushi guy out there. He does sushi Long Duck Tong, yep Tong. He's from Burma, I think. When I talked to him I think he said he's from Burma. Great sushi out there, and then of course me out there with the barbecue. So we're out there primarily to try to help offset that kitchen ebbs and flows so that they're able to keep up with the customer base. I foresee being out there for the rest of the summer. They invited me to stay as long as I wanted. I don't know, until we get there, if the customer base will be there for me into the fall, into the winter, but I think for the most part I'll be back there next, next year, um to, like I said, hopefully expand and see. Maybe we go um further and out Um, let's see. If there was another point.
Speaker 2:I feel like you're really at that, uh, at that stage where, like word of mouth and you know, advertising is a big deal because a lot of people that have come like I was there Saturday a lot of the people that come there don't even know you're there, right, right. So it's going to take time for people to realize that's barbecue is there. They can come there and they don't have to order. They don't have to order from Sweetwater's menu. They can come outside and they can order fats barbecue. Order from Sweetwater's menu. They can come outside and they can order Fats Barbecue. I think that's going to take time.
Speaker 1:And the great thing about that is you get a table of maybe eight people, because you do get groups of people that go there. Maybe somebody wants apps from inside or somebody else wants barbecue and you can just split up your parties Absolutely, people can go order what they want. Somebody wants sushi.
Speaker 2:The whole table can order apps from Sweetwater, but you guys can go outside and order brisket from you know Fat's Barbecue. Yeah, I don't think people really know that yet. I don't think that people let it really understand that, other than the people that maybe come there every weekend. Yeah, sure, they'll get, they'll catch on, but when you're somebody that only comes there once or twice a year, you roll in there, you come out, you sit down, you get a menu that's for Sweetwater. You don't even realize Fats Barbecue is there and I think that's just going to take time.
Speaker 3:The fact that very few restaurants, especially, like you know, a Sweetwater it's on the water offering different cuisines that they're establishing. It's different. It's weird, right, people are used to that, so people aren't used to it. But I think it's a great, I think it's a good thing, it's a great concept. I think it's great, you know, I think that you know other places that you may go along the Eastern Seaboard or along any river, right, I mean, you go there and you're eating their specific niche thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, I think it was really bold for Sweetwater to kind of say hey, you know, we want to introduce other small businesses, give them a shot, give them a chance. We've been there, we've done that and, you know, given us an opportunity to kind of grow with them. I love it. I love the concept. We're different from their menu and I don't think that we really, you know, detract from their mission. I don't think we detract from their. I think we, if anything, compliment their menu, give them a little something extra to you might not be a burger or something fried.
Speaker 3:You make something Fish, tacos or the kind of seafood thing they have. Seafood is there and you got barbecue. It's different from what they are already offering and I think it's a good business plan, in my opinion.
Speaker 1:And, let's be honest, someplace like sweetwater. They could do what a lot of restaurants do, and they could. They could offer some pulled pork that they've thrown in the oven, covered, you know, not really smoked, or they can take the road of hey, instead of us doing something that is going to be good, but why don't we bring in something that is, you know, has the capability to have something we can't do? Right, like they don't we bring in something that has the capability to have something we can't do.
Speaker 2:They don't have a smoker, they can't make this. Yeah, they don't have a smoker like you have a smoker, they can't even make your mac and cheese Right yeah.
Speaker 3:I think they've taken that off their menu. What's that? From what I understand, their staff told me they used to. From what I understand, uh, their staff told me they used to have mac and cheese. They don't yeah I bet, I also think they also also used to have pork, pulled pork as well. That's all. So it helps that you know. I present that on my menu and bring that.
Speaker 1:They're not carrying that overhead, I carry it anymore.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, and, um, you know I have a good relationship with the chef there. I'm allowed, you know, they allow me. I'm using their kitchen. That's great. You know I have space, uh, storage, um, you know, aside from what I have outside, um, but you know, I think, all in all the relationships you know, for only being there a little, a short term, short time, has been very beneficial, very accommodating.
Speaker 2:For our listeners that are anywhere in the vicinity. You're within a couple-hour ride on your motorcycle. Do it, it's definitely a place to ride.
Speaker 2:Just do it. I'm telling you it's a great vibe, it's a really cool place to hang out there for a while. They have bands, they have music, so it really is just a fun place to hang out in general. But then to have the barbecue right there, when their kitchen quite often is overwhelmed with the amount of people that are there and the wait times are long, and the barbecue is quick and fast and it's done and ready for you, made to order. Yeah, it's, it's amazing.
Speaker 1:And you can continue to get the drinks from the, from the bar I mean, let's be honest, I had, we had, I had a bucket that was stacy and I was splitting buckets buckets. They have some they have some great drinks.
Speaker 2:It's until you go out there. Like, I really can't like make you understand how cool it is until you get out there, drive out there and be sitting on the river there with that freaking breeze coming off the off the river. Yeah, the vibe it's a it's a crazy atmosphere because it's you got a lot of boaters right, you got a lot of the boaters from the, from the shore of the river, um, that are that are docked there because they have a marina, it's docked, and you got a lot of. Then you'll get a lot of bikers coming in. They have bike parking and then you'll just get a lot of local traffic.
Speaker 2:Um, also, like, it's just a crazy mix of of people, but it really just works and it vibes and it's it's. It's a really cool atmosphere and, um, I think if you get there and you order the barbecue and you don't have to wait that long for the food and it's as amazing as it is, it's a good time, it's a really good time, it's a good. That's your Saturday, that's your Sunday, whatever it's can't really beat it.
Speaker 1:It's definitely a good way to spend a South Jersey weekend day Saturday or Sunday. Yeah, yeah definitely.
Speaker 2:Oh man, they also have games.
Speaker 3:They also have cornhole out there. Games for kids to play there's chess, they got that human-sized checkers and other games out there. Top-notch entertainment.
Speaker 2:They've done a lot over the last couple years since they built the new building and the addition and stuff and kind of transformed it. They've done a lot to make it really a place to hang out and have fun and play games Like you said they got the banquet hall.
Speaker 3:You can reserve the banquet hall If you guys got events coming up or what have you. They got a banquet hall upstairs. Nice, it's got its perks.
Speaker 1:Nice, it has its perks, we're wrapping just over two hours, nice. So I mean there's you know it's it's got his perks. Nice, it has, it has perks. So who were wrapping just over two hours here? I?
Speaker 2:got all flushed when you brought in the mac that was it, man.
Speaker 1:The mac and cheese came in all of a sudden. The food coma was done quick. So anything you guys uh left uncovered uh, well, I mean, I'm sure that we can dive a lot deeper to some of the stuff we talked about.
Speaker 2:I mean we can talk about when you used to wear those leopard print panties for wrestling. Leopard print.
Speaker 3:I was hoping we were going to get into a beggars brews and barbecue thing. I knew you were waiting on that?
Speaker 1:Are you going to cut that out?
Speaker 3:No, son of a bitch.
Speaker 2:I would love. I like you. I like you, mark. I like to dream big as well. Like you, I'm a dreamer dude. I just got to get the frigging.
Speaker 3:Listen, we don't got to get him to do anything. The frigging frugal one over there. Just sleep on it, mr Rationality over here Never, ever going to be a place like baggers, brews and barbecue.
Speaker 1:That almost sounds like a bike rally.
Speaker 2:I mean, just imagine it does have a ring.
Speaker 3:It's a beautiful thing.
Speaker 2:What do you guys think? What do you guys think we need?
Speaker 3:to do something.
Speaker 2:Baggers brews and barbecue.
Speaker 1:Let us know, Leave some comments If you're watching on YouTube baggers bruisin barbecue you can't even say without smiling now because I know it's exciting, I know it's gonna happen so listen as we wrap this up, though.
Speaker 1:Um and I know there's, there are, there are a handful of younger people who listen to this. There are actually and uh, for those people who, like, are, like out of high school, maybe trying to find their way, thinking about joining the military, what advice, having gone through essentially, a lifetime of a service, what piece of advice could you give them as they're contemplating that? It's a tough one to know.
Speaker 3:I'm leaving you with yeah Well, so I could say it's, it's, it's not a bad decision right.
Speaker 1:No decision is a bad decision. No decision, we come from.
Speaker 2:We come from.
Speaker 3:Brown Having no, crack no decision and no plan is a bad decision, yeah Right, so um, I was there, I've been there. Uh, decision, yeah Right, so um, I was there, I've been there. Uh, no direction, no mentorship. I mean in in coming from the same place, you all know the coaching. I mean, who did you look for forward to to give you any advice? You know it was just, yeah, mitch. Mitch was a good dude. God bless him. Mitch was a good dude, um, mitch was a good dude, um, but just that's about it coming out as a high school kid there wasn't a not a lot of direction yeah
Speaker 3:someone pull you aside and say you know, hey, I see something in you, this is where you need to go, what you need to do, right? I would say, not knowing who, you are out there, if you don't have direction and you do not have a plan, there's nothing wrong with sacrificing four years at a minimum of your of your life to find some. Really, there's not. Yeah, if you think you're a college person, right. Leaving high school and going into a college program without a full ride, scholarship could leave you in some certain debt. Yeah, correct, right.
Speaker 3:If you go to the military and sign on the dotted line, you owe nobody, nothing other than four years of your life, which you're giving to any institution in the first place. If you choose to decide to go to college or the military, if you choose to do nothing, you owe nobody, nothing, but you go nowhere. Go nowhere, right. So, with that, if those two things being on the pendulum right four years of school and coming out four years and owing somebody hundreds of thousands of dollars of tuition and trying to find a job to pay that tuition back or what I say is, go to the military and you know, let the military pay for it. Yeah, they'll give you free money to take whatever classes you want to take, whatever you want to do.
Speaker 3:The caveat that what the college doesn't give you, that the military does, is OJT on the job training. So say you go to the military and say you want to be a vet tech or a nurse or whatever field you choose to go into, not only are you doing the job as an apprentice for four years and you also choose to do college at the same time, and the military pays for it. You have two things you have OJT and you also have a college degree at the four years, uh, at the end of your four years of the military service in college, all you have is a degree and debt and debt. Yeah. So what would you rather have? Yeah, and the other thing, too is is that with the military side, you're more marketable than you are coming out of college.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think 100% you are yeah.
Speaker 3:In my opinion, to me, to set you up for success is give four years of your life to service, right? You're going to give your four years up to somebody. I mean, I mean, think about it, You're going to give four years up. So would you rather give up four years and oh? Or would you rather give up four years and be successful and move forward in your life? And you may. And at a high school did we really know what we wanted?
Speaker 1:no idea no.
Speaker 3:So nine times out of ten, when you end up going out of high school to college, you're studying something you never even wanted to pursue in the first place. I still don't know what I want to do, but you had to choose something, because you were forced to choose your force yeah, right, yeah yeah.
Speaker 3:So it's kind of you know, you need to kind of figure out who you are and and I would say to some of the young people and I tell my son the same thing, he's going into a sophomore year when you're alone in your room, pause for a minute on your video games and your FaceTime with your friends and whatever it is you're doing in your room, and figure out who you are Like. Who are you? What makes you tick? You know who you are as a person, not who you are like what you're doing in high school athletics, right, what mom and dad want you to be. But when you are alone in your head, who are you? My son Gabriel, who are you? My son gabriel, who are you gabe? What makes you tick? Right and start to figure out what.
Speaker 3:What is that plan before it's too late now, if you are senior in high school and you're like, oh shit, I haven't done that, I don't know what the fuck to do. Well, the escape plan is what I did. I went to the military, figured out who the fuck I was, because the military, very quickly, is going to give you a lot of discipline, leadership, a lot of them. You know characters and personality traits that we lost as a society. In my opinion, they're, you know, they're going to reinstill those into you because they're going to give you a lot of responsibility and a lot of time in a very short time, yeah, and you're going to figure out very quickly who you are as a person.
Speaker 3:Can you handle it or can you not? Are you going to break? Are you going to fold? Are you going to step up to the challenge? Right, yeah, so if you do not know who you are and what you want to do, college and studying something that you do not know nothing about is not the plan. Yeah, partying at an extreme cost. Listen, I like to party, I do. I like, I like girls, girls out there, like boys. You know, I get it. You want to have a good time. I'm going to tell you four years in high school doing that, another four years in college doing that. That's eight years wasted. After that, there's no more umbrella, there's no more float, no more raft.
Speaker 1:Some people don't even get that long of an umbrella.
Speaker 3:What I'm saying. There's no safety net. Yeah Right, now you are to society, you're a grown-up, you need to, you need to fucking do something. You need to. You need to. You need to bring money to the table.
Speaker 2:Yeah right, pay taxes, pay bills the reality is, even if you join out of high school and you do your four years and you maybe fine, don't think it's for you and you don't really like it, and you get out like what's the worst that happened. You got a lot of good experiences. You've got a lot of good education in leadership, like you said, and you served your country for four years and you're not in debt, like you're not coming out of it in debt, like you do after four years of college and you probably have just as good a chance of getting a job coming out of that as you do coming out of it like you do
Speaker 3:after four years of college and zero debt, and you probably have just as good a chance of getting a job coming out of that, as you do at a coming to college right the military, you know, after your four years you've paid your, that, you've done your. You've done your due, that's it whatever you've done in your four years is what you do there's something to be said you can do four years and not do nothing, just just serve.
Speaker 3:Or you can boot camp. You get into your organization, your company, your unit and you start college right away and you knock out your four years before you get out. You got OJT. You got four years of college. You owe no debt to nobody. You got OJT. And then, when you're ready to get out in four years or five years, you're ready to hit the job market. There's so much to be said for dude, I mean it's, it's for that route, it's like it's a no brainer. It's a no brainer.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Or or oh. A hundred thousand dollars $200,000 to your said college. While you're trying to work it off to you, you're going to try to apply for a job that you're not going to be qualified for period. So you're going to make minimum wage and do the math. What's the percentage on yearly wage?
Speaker 1:to pay that $200,000 back if that's what you're doing, Coming out of the top tier colleges, I mean, unless you're going to Ivy League, coming out of some of the top tier colleges, right now you're looking at like a $75,000 salary which saddled with $100,000 worth of loans, having to live on your own or having to do something else. Why put yourself through that?
Speaker 3:It isn't a lot. Why, as a young person, put that stress on yourself? As a young person, yeah.
Speaker 1:Don't do that.
Speaker 3:Don't do that.
Speaker 2:As an older person. I have so many friends that came out of high school, got in the military, did 20 years, got out, got jobs. And the people that I know got jobs, you know, connected to the military. But as civilians, man, they're just doing good. They're just doing really, really good in life. You know. They get out, they did their 20 years of service, they got a military pension. They got another full-time job that pays really well because it's based off the experiences and the things that they learned in the military. So they got those jobs. Because of that, they're making another job. They got another job that's paying great, you know, and they're doing that while collecting their military pension. Like they're in really good spots. I was, I was always jealous of them, I worked with them and I'm like man, I wish I was that dude Like well, let's put it in perspective, right?
Speaker 3:So here I am. I'm going to be 50 in December. Damn, you're old. I left straight out of high school, graduated senior 94. Yeah, there was some breaks in my service, but I finished my time, right, I don't owe anybody anything. I have no debt. I'm married with a 15 year old child and I live in a $450,000 house. My wife works at the VA making I don't know 60 000 a year, and I'm retired collecting my pension. And we you know we we pay our up. You know, we're able to live in a 400 000 house and, to be honest with you, I don't even need the barbecue business. Yeah, so if that helps, right, like I don't need to do anything, right, I could just sit at home and play with my dog, joe, and, you know, make sure my kid gets to his trainings and practices every day and day during a week.
Speaker 2:I don't need to do nothing, yeah, you know you do, though, but I do, you do but I do you know you don't need to, but I would not for the books, for the books, mentally you do, but for the books you don't have to.
Speaker 3:Right, yeah, but what I'm saying is that for your viewers out there, for them young folk out there, like, if you know, like, do you want to? I'm not stressing, yeah, you know, I could have retired, like, had I not got out in 99 and stayed in, I'd have been retired at, you know, 43 years old.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And would have been in the same position instead of being at 48, eight when I got out. You know what I'm saying yeah, yeah, 48. So you know, like, don't put yourself through. Like you know, don't put yourself at risk, like that. I mean $100,000, $200,000 in debt as a young person and for a lot of those people to get out and still not know what they're going to do. No, and a lot of people don't.
Speaker 2:Like when they get out of college, they still don't know what they want. A lot of those degrees aren't worth much and they're still $100,000 in debt.
Speaker 3:Without on-the-job training, they're not worth nothing, and it's it's a it's a bad picture that the society is painting for you my degree hasn't been applicable to what I've been doing for 20 years.
Speaker 1:I mean, I haven't been a nurse and yeah, just do the research.
Speaker 3:23 years, don't take my my, you know my advice don't do the research, you know. I mean like who am I go do the research? How many people go to college and, you know, come out and get the job that they want?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and there's a lot of businesses out there that really, really really value that military service experience. But I can tell you and you're going to end up in a in a great spot. Listen, you know, with that, with that experience, I had a comparative company man.
Speaker 1:I had a comparative company man. Every guy they hired was a West Point grad. It was like every time you could see these guys walk through the door, like here comes another West Point grad, it was like whatever manager in medical sales, whatever manager they had there.
Speaker 3:They hired like four or five West Point grads and it was just like they would walk in and it was like a unit when they walked in and they were all business and they were military and they were all West Point officers and that's the other point too is when you walk into a job interview, too, without even being in debt and having four years of military and a degree, you bring so much more to the table than your peer who just went to college. Yeah, you do Leadership right Presence, you know, being able to formulate plans and lead teams, and you know. Like there's so much more you bring to the table to a company, a CEO you know or an organization, like you're remiss. If you think that just, ah, I'm going to stick it out, just go to college.
Speaker 2:The skills, the skills, the skills, the skills. You learn From four years of being in the military to four years of college. I can't even imagine as someone that didn't go in the military.
Speaker 3:Grow up, I'm telling you you grow up it's forced on you.
Speaker 2:You know you're you're forced to learn these things in a much different way than you're first forced to learn. You know the books that you're being taught in college. Like it's very different and you learn more in a short period of time, I think a lot faster. It's pretty wild, it is. It's pretty cool. It's actually pretty cool and it and it makes a lot of sense to see so many former military folk like doing great things out there. You know, and we and in in the field where you know we're in in social media and stuff and youtube and and podcasting and stuff and seeing and a lot of the folks that we see are special forces guys and stuff. But you know they're still using that stuff that they. They learn you will apply, you know, the rest of your life.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's wild and it's and all that it makes sense the relationships, the networking, like there's so much more that I'm not even hitting on that you get out of just military service that you won't. Yeah, you'll have your frats and your, you know sororities and stuff like that, but I'm telling you there it's gotta be tighter, just because of the stuff that we spoke earlier on about being in the trenches and you know, going through those adversities with people, you know making decisions and planning and you know, like there's so many things that I just you know on the spot, I just can't think of at the moment. But you know, your network is going to be so broad, and not only just from the people that you knew in the military, but people that you didn't know that were in the military. Yes, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:There's a solid connection.
Speaker 3:Like you don't understand, like people that walk up to my barbecue spot that were in the military and see my Marine Corps flag flying outside of my shack and just buy shit, walk up to me and say I only came up here because you were a Marine, I served and I hope your stuff is good, and it was. I mean they enjoyed it, but only they just gave me a chance because they saw my flag. Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's pretty cool.
Speaker 3:I just wanted to share. And it was a guy pulling his boat. First time in Sweetwater Marina, up from upstate I think, new York or whatever was down with his boat and it was a Marine Corps vet, had his own construction business and was pulling his boat in and I saw his EGA on the side of his truck, on his logo and said, hey, I'm a Marine too. He stopped what he was doing wife, kids, everybody 100 degrees outside putting his boat in the water, stopped his family and said everybody, time to fuck out, walked over, got barbecue from me because I was a marine.
Speaker 1:That's cool that's what it's about that that's.
Speaker 3:But that's that shit, that's what it's, you know, I mean like you don't see that in companies and you know, just stop with you know your family.
Speaker 2:You're gonna stop your family, dude, yeah yeah that's crazy, that's awesome yeah that's really cool and I think that's an awesome opportunity that right now, as you progress in your barbecue journey, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:No, I appreciate y'all having me on. Yeah, tell us a story.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's a honor to have you. Thank you for your you know.
Speaker 2:You know if we could do this we could do this around a fire pit man, oh yeah. It'd be interesting while I'm smoking. I hope we did the best we could presenting this to you in a uh, a formal podcast environment. Obviously, we go way back and we could hang out and shoot this shit and talk about this stuff all night long with some some 1990s country music and some bourbon at around a fire pit.
Speaker 2:Um but, I'm glad we can have you on to talk about it and just to kind of highlight you, cause I really think what you're doing is really cool and, um, I'm so proud of you for just you know, not only for your service, cause I've always been proud of you for that, but, um, for what you're doing after the fact and now, like really pursuing your, your dreams and your goals and and a passion that you have. So, um, I think, if you know, more people pursue their passion instead of worried about you know, paying the bills and and following you know what society says you should do right and we'd all be better off. But, um, definitely proud of you for doing it, man, you know I love you, I love you guys too. This is really cool. It's really fun to have you on and talk about some stuff. Some of the stuff we talked about I didn't even you know, you and I have never talked about, right, so pretty cool.
Speaker 3:Yeah, maybe we'll do a special edition where we'll bring the Q out on the offseason. If you want, it's up to you.
Speaker 2:Hey, listen, we can always have you back on as a return guest. Let the viewers see the cue. Absolutely, we can have some fun with it man, the big 250-gallon smoker.
Speaker 1:Smoker. What do you got? You're quiet over there. No man, that's it. I had a bottle of Redemption Bourbon and now I got a quarter bottle of Redemption Bourbonbon cost me lovely cost me like four hours an episode you guys uh enjoy the barbecue thank you, sir, it's awesome.
Speaker 2:Thank you, thanks for coming on you and your barbecue, because I'm on, I'm trying, I'm trying to lose weight and your barbecue is not helping, bro, not helping mac and cheese is great. I brought a small dish and you make the mac and cheese right yes, sir, yeah, everything is from a big mac and cheese is great. I brought a small dish and you make the mac and cheese right. Yes, sir.
Speaker 3:Yeah, everything is from scratch. Big mac and cheese fan, it's really good. Yep, everything is, like I said, made on the smoker, except for the coleslaw.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:Well.
Speaker 2:I know the coleslaw is not the best coleslaw, but we get that title to your wife.
Speaker 3:But I'm biased and I'm biased, I'll never take that title no, it's amazing dude, it really is.
Speaker 2:I mean I could sit here and friggin yep I know you could glow on his barbecue all night long. But seriously, if you guys are, you know, if you're listening from nebraska, you're not going to try. Come on down, that's barbecue.
Speaker 3:Maybe at some point you'll be able to order online. I have two bedrooms I will hold you up a dance.
Speaker 2:Oh wow, You're going to have 40 people lined up.
Speaker 3:I have two bedrooms, not 40. I have two bedrooms. If you come from Nebraska, I'll talk my wife into letting you.
Speaker 2:If you're a Marine, you got a spot to stay. If you're not, well.
Speaker 3:If you're a Marine, you come here all day long or. Navy.
Speaker 2:Good stuff, good stuff, dude. Well, again, awesome stuff. I'm proud of you. We'll have you back on again. We'll do this again soon and see how far you progress, because I know you're going to do great things with this. I know your passion is there. Your drive is obviously there.
Speaker 1:The military service. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2:All of us owe you a debt of gratitude for that. But yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited that you got what you got going on, dude, and I'm going to let George take us away, cause I'll just keep on and George is sitting there just looking at me, cause he knows, I'll just keep on eating burgers and barbecue and George is sitting there just looking at me because he knows I'll just keep going and going and going Baggers, burgers and barbecue bro.
Speaker 1:I got, I got, I got him.
Speaker 2:There you go, baggers burgers and barbecue.
Speaker 1:I got, I got him rambling, I got you trying to give him the subliminal messages Listen, if you've done for our country no, my pleasure thank you for providing us with some damn good barbecue.
Speaker 3:I appreciate it.
Speaker 1:I hope your listeners enjoy the content and I'm sure we'll have you on again yeah, please do, because we've got some stuff to go into that I hadn't even considered until I'm sitting here listening to. So we'll do that. And if you're watching us on YouTube, hit that subscribe on youtube. Hit that subscribe button, hit that like button and, um, leave us a comment or leave us a rating remember, five stars on apple is the best stars and leave us a nice little comment. We appreciate it. Um, thank you to legendary usa for sponsoring this podcast and in the link below.
Speaker 1:We do have um some limited merchandise available in the this american ride store, um which will be also linked below, and uh, that's about it.
Speaker 2:So if your cornbread don't have corn in it. It ain't cornbread, george told me that this week what. What's up?
Speaker 3:If your barbecue can't stand alone, it ain't no barbecue. Don't need the sauce that. There you go.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 3:I'm at Fats Barbecue on Instagram.
Speaker 2:Yeah when else.
Speaker 3:Where else? My Facebook page is still under construction. It'll be on Facebook.
Speaker 2:But Fats Barbecue on Instagram. Check him out, give him a follow and you'll know what he's got going on. And you out. Give him a follow and you'll know what he's got going on. And you can also follow sweet water marina and river deck, which is where he has his place and uh and definitely follow uh baggers and brews and this american ride, american ride on instagram.
Speaker 1:Uh, fabric, follow them all and if you're following this american ride, or baggers and brewers, you'll see us, uh, sharing some fats, barbecue stuff Always always, always love you guys.
Speaker 2:So, all right, All right Till the next one. Guys, thanks for listening, thanks for watching and we'll see you next time Later.
